In honor of the All Star Game in Anaheim and the Halos 50 Year anniversary; over the next few weeks, periodically, Halos Heaven will be posting polls to allow baseball fans to vote on the all Angel All Star team. So please vote early and often...
0 recs | 36 comments
Gotta be Bengie. 2002 WS Champion.
Wally's World - June 5, 2010
i feel the same way
A champion over rules all
DAD OF VLAD - June 5, 2010
Man that A's dugout looks scary to be in with a lefty batter up at the plate.
eyespy - June 5, 2010
and since when could umpires weigh less than 300lbs?
eyespy - June 5, 2010
The A's looked pretty pumped to see a play at the plate.
cupie - June 5, 2010
beer league
and the cooler is empty
eyespy - June 5, 2010
Where is Jorge Fabregas?
ryanfea - June 5, 2010
+ 1
halofan4life - June 5, 2010
voted for Downing, though his best years were mostly in left-field
tanana40 - June 5, 2010
that's the only reason I didn't vote for him, but instead for Bengie
I loved BD’s bat, but he was fairly mediocre behind the dish. I’d probably pick him as the all time Halos left fielder though.
Quad Fin Rider - June 5, 2010
agreed
tanana40 - June 5, 2010
GA would argue that he's the best left fielder
If he weren’t so lazy
BruinHalo - June 5, 2010 via mobile
Downing had two of the top five (and maybe three) seasons ever by an Angel catcher
No one else can say that.
Here’s a 2006 post of mine on historical Angels catchers some may find of interest.
mattwelch - June 5, 2010
fascinating, everyone remembers 1979 but who knew that his 1978 year ranked so high
tanana40 - June 5, 2010
Lotta games caught, OBP 20 points higher than league AVG, Angels +3 on Pythag...
… adds up. He was probably young/healthy enough to be decent behind the dish back then, too.
mattwelch - June 5, 2010
Downing was great with the bat when he played catcher, but he was only there for two and a half seasons as an Angel. I can’t give a guy who played less than 325 games at catcher the top spot for the Angel catcher position.
Although if we’re just talking standout performance for one season (which is really all the All Star game cares about), then Downing’s ’79 is far and away the best.
Gorbachav5 - June 5, 2010
Yeah, there wasn't even a question in my mind.
Downing all the way.
Turks Teeth - June 5, 2010
Personally...
I voted for Brian Downing to get in the good grace of Matt Welch.
In all seriousness, I voted for Downing because of those aforementioned seasons and superficially, the batting stance.
cupie - June 5, 2010
Didn't he start "the stance"
after bulking up? That would be in the Left Field-playing Downing years.
Downing Rules - June 9, 2010
and then he became a ranger...
like all aging Angel stars…
BryanHarvey'sMoustache - June 5, 2010
thats Boone in the photo, btw...
I wasn’t even born yet but I can tell because, off the top of my head, II hesitantly think that Forsch didnt play with Downing.
BryanHarvey'sMoustache - June 5, 2010
wrong
Forsch and Downing played together from 1981-1986.
ryanfea - June 5, 2010
damn, well you cant blame too bad...
after all, i admitted to going off the top of my head…and in 86, i was 3.
BryanHarvey'sMoustache - June 6, 2010
Wow, who voted for Buck besides me
Must be someone really ancient.
vladtheimpaler - June 5, 2010
Dang, just noticed cupie posted this
I thought some UFA soccer blog stole you away. Good to have you back.
vladtheimpaler - June 5, 2010
This is just a ruse to sneak Downing in by the back door...
…since he won’t get in in the outfield.
Molina B – has to be…
The Limey - June 6, 2010
You can't really justify picking a guy who started only 2 seasons at catcher...
…ahead of players who played 5, 6, 7 seasons there and nowhere else and did a great job as catchers.
He’s only down as a catcher because you know he won’t get past GA in left field or whichever you put in RF/DH from Salmon and Vlad (which is also a bit of a con, since they were both RFs really).
It’s a fix – he’s here because he’s Brian Downing, not because he’s the best catcher. Because he’s not. One of our best outfielders / DHs, not our best catcher
VOTE MOLINA!
The Limey - June 6, 2010
Sure you can -- by valuing impact over longevity
I would, for example, rank Orlando Cabrera above Gary DiSarcina & Dick Schofield (even though the latter was a personal favorite of mine), because those two dudes, sadly, never played remotely as well as O-Cab’s Angel peak.
Also, there’s the extra credit for batting stance & post-positional activities…
mattwelch - June 6, 2010
since Chris Turner isn't on the list...
he of the however-many consecutive on base appearances….
i went with bob boone.
Kernel - June 6, 2010
Halos 50th Anniversary
is next year, not this year. Biggs said it’s going to be special.
HaloDewey - June 6, 2010
this is their 50th season
Rev Halofan - June 6, 2010
Where's Tom Satriano?
red floyd - June 6, 2010
I love Downing
but I voted for Bengie.
We had season tickets starting in 79, and for some reason I don’t remember Downing as a catcher at all.
opiejeanne - June 6, 2010
How much did beer cost back then?
eyespy - June 6, 2010
Here's something that might help the evaluatin'.
These are the top 7 catchers in Angels history (the six listed in the poll, plus Ellie Rodriguez), ranked by Win Shares. The first number on the left is career Win Shares earned as an Angel in seasons they were primarily catchers (that clause pertains most to Brian Downing, obviously). The second is a tally of their Win Shares each season, ranked most to fewest. Note that I adjusted all seasons to 162 games. Hope the formatting isn’t so
WS NM: 01/02/03/04/05/06/07/08/09
79 BB: 18/13/12/10/10/09/07
76 BM: 16/15/13/11/10/08/03/00
68 BR: 15/14/12/10/06/06/03/01/01
53 LP: 24/15/12/02
43 BD: 25/18
42 MN: 13/11/10/08
27 ER: 18/09
Win Shares, remember, are calculated by a taking a team’s wins, multiplying by three, then divvying it up among the players via a hellishly complicated formula concocted by Bill James. Generally speaking, 23-29 Win Shares is an All-Star type season, 30-34 is MVP candidate territory, 35-40 is MVP-winning territory, 18-22 is a pretty good regular, and 14-17 is a decent full-time contributor (or terrific part-timer). Ratchet that scale down a few pegs for catchers, who can’t play 150 games a year.
What raw Win Shares don’t tell you is how much opportunity they required to accumulate, and also how much better the player was than a replacement-quality hitter. Both measurements are satisfied by Wins Above Replacement, which unlike WS are meant to correlate to actual individual wins, as opposed to 3×. Running the same exercise as above, we suddenly have new respect for … Mike Napoli!
WAR NM: 0.1/0.2/0.3/0.4/0.5/0.6/0.7/0.8/0.9
10.6 BB: 3.1/2.8/1.7/1.6/1.4/1.1/1.1
9.9 MN: 2.6/2.6/2.1/1.7/0.9
8.9 BD: 6.1/2.8
7.3 LP: 4.1/1.6/1.3/0.3
7.2 BM: 2.3/2.0/1.5/0.4/0.4/0.4/0.0/0.0
4.5 ER: 3.5/1.0
2.5 BR: 1.7/1.5/0.8/0.7/0.4/0.0/0.5/1.0/1.1
Italics indicate negative value.
Napoli will be the Angels career leader in WAR by a catcher before the end of 2010. And he’s never had 400 ABs in a season.
mattwelch - June 6, 2010
I voted for Bengie
It’s gotta go to him because he did such a great job catching and was such a clutch hitter during the 2002 season. I almost voted for Bob Boone, because he is the Angels catcher that I remember best from my early days as an Angels fan. Hell, I almost voted for Downing because he is one of my favorite Halos of all time, regardless of his history as a catcher. But, in the end, it’s gotta be Benjie cause he played such a huge part in helping our team get their first world series rings.
HalosFanInNorCal - June 7, 2010
You must Login with your SB Nation account and be a member of Halos Heaven to post a comment.