While trade rumors swirl about Jake Peavy being traded to the Chicago White Sox in return for prospects, I can exhale. In the back of my mind, since Spring I have been worried that Jered Weaver and Brandon Wood were being boxed and gift wrapped for Bud Black and the San Diego Padres.
Besides the old gut just having one of those feelings about it, there were many reasons I was opposed to the Peavy trade that I can now articulate:
SALARY ... when the Angels are selling 10,000 fewer tickets for a visiting RED SOX series, the likelihood of a quick recovery for teams to afford the salaries of yore may be a few years off from now.
FLEXIBILITY ... as in, we'd have NONE, with Jake still having his no-trade clause.
ELBOW ... he missed 26 games with a bark in his.
SHOULDER ... missed time in 2006 with an owie there, too.
PETCO ... Jose Lima has a future as a Padre when you think about it. This pitcher's park inflates his numbers. To what degree is debatable, but it has to lower his trade value.
NATIONAL LEAGUE ... Basically he has been facing AAA lineups, one in nine batters are not professional hitters and many of his away games are in the pitching-friendly Chavez Latrine as well. Imagine him in Fenway Park in October throwing heat that goes to the track in Echo Park and the Gaslamp district... it would end up in the Citgo neon, and were he pitching for the Angels... well that doesn't change the story of our recent Octobers.
EVERYDAY PLAYERS ... Trading pitching for pitching is one thing, but the Angels would be trading from their depth and the only middle infield prospect that would bring Peavy would be Brandon Wood. Aybar and Saunders would be too much, Wood and Weaver wold be suicide. Trading a player who plays 162 games for one who plays 33 games still does not add up. If the player you trade goes on to be an all star and the player you get ends up on the disabled, that alone is terrible, but if both function at a high level, perhaps All-Star caliber, thanks, I will take the player punching the clock every day.
Maybe I am spoiled by years of the Angels producing their own home-grown pitching talent and using free agency to pull in decent depth, but Jake Peavy, his no-trade clause, his Hedge Fund-era salary and his Petco padded numbers are a gamble that Tony Reagins need not break out the ninja gear for.
0 recs | 44 comments
I used to think Peavy to Angels would be cool but now...
I think the team should just stay how it is. Maybe I’m crazy, but I think things will turn around and be fine come fall. At least for a division title. World Series title though????
Just bring up Brandon Wood for Christ’s sake!
Monkeyspanked - May 21, 2009
dependson lackey
are we going re-sign him? for how much? its not like he’s been completely healthy the last 2 years.
saying that i always prefer homegrown talent over FA or Trades.
HALO_86 - May 21, 2009
I wonder how many rebuttals to this will be:
“OMG BUT HE WON A CY YOUNG AWARD!!!!!!!! U R KRAZEE!!!!!”
Higz - May 21, 2009
Oh my god. But he won a Cy Young award!!!!!! You're crazy.
Mayheminthehood - May 21, 2009
See! I totally called it!
Higz - May 21, 2009
So did Bartolo Colon.
We should trade for him!
MidwayCityLivestock - May 21, 2009
Why go with imitations?
Let’s trade for Cy Young!!!!
red floyd - May 21, 2009
100% Agree
With this post. Not too take anything away from Peavy as a pitcher, but it clearly didn’t make sense to give up that much for him.
Spird - May 21, 2009
Peavy sounds skeevy.
Mayheminthehood - May 21, 2009
Peavy not too excited about the trade... Block?
Link
thrill000 - May 21, 2009
Rev makes some great points.
But Towers is going to get a little desperate. Moving Peavy is more a salary relief than an attempt to get equal value. Maybe I’m of the minority, but I don’t think it will take Wood or Saunders.
I think Reagins should take Towers out to a Del Taco and propose this…
Anthony Ortega, Matt Palmer, Shane Loux, and Maicer Izturis.
Palmer has proven that he could hang in the AL West going 5-0. Ortega is still considered to be a highly touted prospect. Shane Loux can help either bullpen or the starting rotation today. And Slap Happy Maicer can start or add depth at either 3B, SS, or 2B. If that isn’t enough I’m sure Bud Black would be happy to see Mathis included in that deal.
Jay Cal - May 21, 2009
whoa, there goes our pitching depth
mastermind565 - May 21, 2009
Ortega is highly touted?
Not sure where you are getting that. I have never read anything that indicated he is.
hauldog - May 21, 2009
really?
Because I remember hearing great things about him in Spring. Wasn’t he promoted from Single A to AAA?
Jay Cal - May 21, 2009
He started 22 in AA in 2008
I have read he is a 4 or 5 at best
hauldog - May 21, 2009
it would have to be
O’Sullivan or Reckling instead of Ortega, and they really can’t do that much with Loux or Palmer.
I’d try for O’Sullivan, Aybar, Bulger and a smaller prospect.
howiestheman - May 21, 2009
I'm okay with that.
But I think we have to give up a MLB Ready Starter
Jay Cal - May 21, 2009
Whoa there...
A ridiculous post…Palmer hasn’t proven anything…other than that he can be extremely lucky. Right now, among all starters, he has the lowest BABIP. Basically, guys are hitting the ball all over the yard, but right now we’ve got guys standing there to cacth ‘em. That’ll balance out soon. If he has proven himself, so did Ron Romanick (14-9 in 84) and Kent Bottenfield (18-7 in 99). They both stunk, despite those records. There is, for all intents and purposes no right hander in history that pitches to contact, strikes out few, nibbles at the corner and walks more than his share that sustains any long term success. All the balls will find their mates gloves for awhile…but it won’t last.
Loux is much of the same…and so is Ortega, only younger. Izturis is a reserve IF’er who can’t even beat out Erick Aybar for a regular job. You really think this collection of garbage’ will really pry away Peavey?
statlr - May 21, 2009
Maybe not.
But I know that the White Sox were offering 2 MLB Ready pitchers. And 2 prospects.
So tell me who would you trade?
Jay Cal - May 21, 2009
Ace quality pitchers don't fall from trees very often and there are alot fewer of them when they do become available.
Infielders are more easily replaced or traded for because there are many more of them floating around. Saying a player is not desirable because he had some injury way back when is a weak argument because injuries are so much a part of any professional sport. Remember during the off season everybody was saying Frankie Rodriguez was’nt worth paying a huge salary because his arm would fall off. Well that could happen but it certainly has not to this point.
I was big on Peavy before but with the pitching depth we have now, and a promise of more on the way, I would be looking for a big bat which would help the team more this minute. We need to build on the middle of the batting order. Vlad is in his final glorious days.
44FAN - May 21, 2009
Let's first see what the Padres are getting in return
The initial rumors of players going from the Sox do not look like a very impressive haul for the Padres. There’s only one legit prospect in the current rumors. If true, the proposed trades in the off season would have been more lucrative for the Padres.
If Peavy can be had for a top pitching prospect, and several “potential prospects” – why not do the deal? At this point, I’m just not buying that we’d have to trade the caliber of talent (e.g. Wood and Saunders) being speculated upon in this thread.
mustard_man - May 21, 2009
It was awkward to try to trade the children when they (Padres owner and his wife) were in the middle of a nasty divorce.
44FAN - May 21, 2009
I still want Peavy
I don’t think his contract is too high.
I think he would be one of the top pitchers in the league.
And on the same link the Rev posted above, they are now saying the trade doesn’t look good. Better take another deep breath, Rev. Come July he will be ours!
vladtheimpaler - May 21, 2009
here's my take
if we are not going to resign lackey than why not go after Jake? the chisox are giving up 4 pitching prospects for him, we could definitely match that offer. the angels are on his list.
sure it’s an extra 50 mil (or so) of contract and we have relatively cheap pitching prospects but this deal (if we can get him for “prospects”) makes sense…
wallispdub1 - May 21, 2009
Well, lets look at actual stats rather than rants from Rev to determine trade value.
His career home/away splits:
W L ERA WHIP SO/9 K/BB GS
Home 43 30 2.81 1.085 9.6 3.73 108
Away 46 37 3.82 1.298 8.3 2.54 100
He has a career ERA over 5 against the BoSox
4.5 ERA Against the Tigers
5.91 Indians
However his interleague ERA is a very good 3.29
He is most effective early in the season, and late, with June and July being his worst two months.
He is most effective in Open Air Stadiums, on Grass, At Night. (for obvious reasons)
For all intensive purposes, he would have an ERA of around 3.5, still be an innings eater, and would be very very good in a postseason run in August/September (2.61 career ERA in August, 3.07 in September)
His age is no factor, as he is entering his pitching prime. His away stats are somewhat influenced by the fact that he has pitched at Coors field (8 starts, near 5 ERA) and Chase Field (13 starts, near 6 ERA)
His contract is extremely reasonable, especially if you take into consideration AJ’s contract, or Sabathia’s, or what Lackey is going to get.
Considering we have too much MI depth, a 24 year old stud waiting to get his ROY trophy waiting in AAA, a third baseman who should be traded before we let him go in FA, and GMJ who would immediately waive his NTC to go to consistent playing time I think it should be a no brainer.
PhiSlamma - May 21, 2009
intensive purposes?
Are those hospitalized dolphins?
Downing Rules - May 21, 2009
too lazy to spell check
but yes, that is what I was going for.
PhiSlamma - May 21, 2009
I believe you were looking for "intents and purposes"
leftwing - May 21, 2009
How would porpoises in tents affect ERA?
rspencer - May 21, 2009
Depends
Is the porpoise in an aquarium or laying on a blanket?
.5 run rise in ERA if pitcher has to go feed it between innings
2 run rise in ERA if pitcher has to go pour water on it after every batter.
Jeeeze. No brainer.
vladtheimpaler - May 22, 2009
i'm all for Peavy
but you really think SD wants GMJ? soon to be FA? you gotta do better then that. they don’t want vet, they want prospects.
HALO_86 - May 21, 2009
Well, I am not often in lock step with the Rev..
but this time he is right on. Peavy has been injured, he does pitch in the most extreme favorable park in the planet (other than Yellowstone), has a questionable delivery, and has logged a lot of IP’s at a young age.
A bit of edification…In Petco, has a 2.71 career ERA, in every other park 3.71.
Some of those ‘home stats’ above include the Jake, which also helped him a lot.
Now 3.71 ain’t bad, but if Weaver, Saunders, Escobar, Lackey and Santana pitch to their now established ability…that makes him our 6th starter…but he’ll be the best damn 6th starter in the league.
Lastly, the idea of a trade is to trade away strength to acquire weakness. We have, without a doubt, one of the worst offenses in the league, and no real top prospect of a hitter any more on the horizon, excluding Wood. No one, other than Angel fans think a whole heckuva lot of Trumbo, Bourjos, Brown or Rodriguez. We also have, without a doubt, the deepest and likely the best rotation and available depth at SP than anyone.
Why oh why would the Angels do this? What they should be doing is seeing what they might be able to get in the way of hitting by trading a Saunders, or an Ortega, or a Walden…
statlr - May 21, 2009
The only distance that matters is the space between the pitcher's mound and home plate.
A pitcher pitches as many games outside his “friendly” park as he does in it. Good ones adapt if they want to be successful.
44FAN - May 21, 2009
oops
Obviously not ‘The Jake’….meant ‘Jack’ Murphy/Qualcomm.
statlr - May 21, 2009
Peavy just said no-go
PhiSlamma - May 21, 2009
LOL I dont blame him one bit either
norcaliangelsfan - May 21, 2009
Maybe when Lackey walks nest year, Arte will take another look at Jake.
44FAN - May 21, 2009
*next
44FAN - May 21, 2009
and to add insult to injury......the twins just touched up the ChiSox 20-1
norcaliangelsfan - May 21, 2009
He said NOPE
chairmanofthebar - May 21, 2009
Jose Lima is a member of the Long Beach Armada I thought...
MidwayCityLivestock - May 21, 2009
Disagree with this post in part...
because we keep holding onto these prospects that never turn out…(Kendrick for example)
Why shouldn’t we make a pitch for Peavy? He’s a heck of a pitcher. That I do know.
And Rev is afraid some Red Sux player is going to hit a home run off him in October- so we shouldn’t be interested? I don’t get the logic.
He’s had sub-3.00 ERA nearly his whole career. Yeah he’s expensive, so what? So was GMJ.
hk47 - May 21, 2009
but, we really need OFFENSE more than pitching
If we do need pitching help, we should look for bullpen help. Shouldda signed Juan Cruz in the offseason when his price dropped like a rock (like with Abreu). No reason to cry over spilled milk.
But, how long can we wait for hitters like Kendrick and Rivera to start hitting, while Brandon Wood, Sean Rodriguez and Matt Brown languish here in Salt Lake. All three of those guys are better than Robb Quinlan for gosh sakes! Maybe send Kendrick down to AAA for a while, DFA Quinlan and let Wood and S-Rod get some hacks in vs ML-level pitching.
Once again, I don’t understand the organization philosophy this season. But let’s just keep holding onto our prospects and keeping the best ones whacking in AAA. Confusing.
hk47 - May 21, 2009
Agreed
This is fucking retarded.
As far as the Peavy situation. Here is what I would trade:
A winning team is something he wants (Check). He’d also want to be close to SD (Check). I can’t help the National league thing… it is what it is (No Check). But my trade offer is Jordan Walden, Anthony Ortega, and Hank Conger. If it get’s the deal done, Freddy Sandoval, or Mark Trumbo. I can’t see them wanting Trumbo though because they already have Gonzalez. Peavy just shut the White Sox down because of winning formula, location, and league. We offer 2 of 3. Will the Cubs up the deal? That means they have to resign Harden as well. Hardens money would likely go to Peavy. Okay, so next year, we make a major play for Harden. The Padres won’t trade within their own division to the Dodgers, so they’re out of the equation. Do the Braves have enough to make the deal happen? That, I don’t know. But if you’re going after Peavy, it needs to happen soon before the dead like approaches and you get into a bidding war.
So basically, the Angels get:
1. Jake Peavy.
The Padres get:
1. Jordan Walden
2. Anthony Ortega
3. Hank Conger
4. And if needed, their choice between Freddy Sandoval, Mark Trumbo, and Erick Aybar.
If we trade Walden, and Ortega, it’s okay because they’re not projected to be in our rotation next year, and likely won’t be for the next three due to our young, outstanding rotation . Hank Conger is blocked by Naps and Mathis, so he is expendable. Sandoval is blocked by Wood and Kendrick, so he is expendable. Trumbo is blocked by Morales so he is expendable. Aybar is expendable because Wood is ready. Move Wood into SS this year. Next year, don’t bring back Figgins and insert Matt Brown at 3rd. All that is saving money for Peavy, Lackey, and a bat or two next year.
This one is a no brainer. Trade for Peavy. Those of you who don’t want him are high.
matt92130 - May 24, 2009
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