When Mike Scioscia's assigned roles for Angel players are clicking, nobody notices. But when there is a rip near the seam, the exposed pathetic rigidity of these uncreative placings outrage even the casual SoCal baseball fan.
The Speier-to-Shields-to-Frankie countdown is designed to make a 9-inning game a 6-inning game. It works often. But when the wheels come loose, Scioscia rarely stops the truck to tighten them. Sometimes the win gets delivered. Other times, like tonight, the axle breaks and you are left wondering if this team will ever burn rubber again.
But it is not just bullpen management. Orlando Cabrera is not a Number Two hitter. He is not a Number Three hitter. But there he is, popping out with regularity in situations both clutch and bases empty. When Robb Quinlan gets into a game, he tends to be left in to face Right-Handed pitching after his usefulness (batting against Lefties) has been exhausted. These are situations that rest squarely on the back of Mike Scioscia.
Scioscia's rigidity in starting the worst offensive Angel of all time, Steve Finley, cost us the 2005 ALCS as much or more than Doug Eddings. The worthless Steve Finley remained in the Angel lineup due to Scioscia's rigidity.
It took Scioscia three seasons to finally start taking John Lackey out in the middle of bad innings rather than let John gascan them into oblivion. What will it take for him to tweak this team into the runaway success we know they should be? Why is Mike Scioscia seemingly allergic to improvisation? Is this season cemented into position regardless of in-game turns and unforeseen events?
0 recs | 32 comments
Quinlan needs to not be played, ever
Kotch is better against lefties then Robb is this yearedhoo - August 3, 2007
OCab is just fine as a no. 2 hitter.
He makes contact well, has good speed, and gap power. He hits number 3 against lefties because Mike likes to have Willits up top due to his .350 average against southpaws.In this case, the problem is that he DIDN'T stick to his role-playing. Why was Quinlan still in the game after Vlad hit the homer? Kotchman's Defense > Q's defense, always. In a tight game, you need your best D on the field. Mike used to make defensive switches for Q with out a second thought once the lefties were out of the game.
I'm a big Q fan, and I have to say I was stumped as to why Q was still in the game.
Zu Long - August 3, 2007
I agree
I was wondering why Kotchman was even out of the game. Gaudin was allowing .267/.376/.378 against lefties in June, worse than right-handed batters; why wasn't Kotchman in the starting lineup f'r chrissakes?scareduck - August 4, 2007
Sorry, make that July
But the point stands. Kotchman wasn't such a liability that it justified keeping him out of the lineup, especially once Vlad hit one out and the starter was done with the game.scareduck - August 4, 2007
It's perfectly reasonable to start Q
He's a lefty-masher for his career, Kotch isn't, and you need to give the guy some ABs to keep him fresh. The mistake is leaving him in with a lead once the lefty starter has gone.mattwelch - August 4, 2007
It's not perfectly reasonable to start him
this yearedhoo - August 4, 2007
Depends on how much you value 50 ABs
Casey vs. Robby vs. LHP in 2007:CK: .304/.377/.391, 55 PAs
RQ: .259/.304/.400, 92 PAs
For their careers:
CK: .253/.339/.295, 113 PAs
RQ: .310/.352/.510, 432 PAs
Q has shown more power against lefties, even this year, on a team that's starving for the stuff.
What I'd do is this -- when Casey's in one of his vaunted hot streaks, never bench him. But when he's cooling off, let Q play against lefties. And when Casey's playing against the lefty, start Q at 3B or LF or DH.
mattwelch - August 4, 2007
Did you mean DiNardo?
As opposed to Gaudin? We beat Gaudin on Thursday.Zu Long - August 4, 2007
Note the tone. Note the date.
Almost like clockwork.Stirrups - August 3, 2007
Who would you bat 1-4, Rev?
WillitsFiggy
Vlad
GA
???
I do agree that Kotch should be playing every day. His defense alone is worth a run on most nights.
I wouldn't switch Shields and Speier. It's just a chink in the armor, if you demoted him to the seventh inning, that would only play more with his psyche.
bc56274 - August 4, 2007
In Quinlan's defense...
Has he had that many at-bats? Man, I think he is struggling due to not being in the lineup hardly at all. He's gotta be rusty.Downing Rules - August 4, 2007
in the field, too...
he has not been playing much at all.Downing Rules - August 4, 2007
My two problems:
- Kotch can hit lefties and righties. He is not a platoon player. He's the Angel's future all-star gold-glove 1st basemen. Sorry Q, but Kotchman has earned the right to play, everyday.
- Shields can stay in the 8th inning, I have no problem with that. HOWEVER, when he is off his game, it's usually clear within 4-8 pitches. He almost NEVER recovers after a first few elevated pitches. With that the case, if he's off his game, Scoscia, for fuck's sake, get somebody else in to pitch, and be quick about it.
Apart from that, I don't have many objections with Scoscia's managing this year.101halo - August 4, 2007
man...
this was a really really really tough loss. I believe this meltdown would of never happend had Kotchman been our first baseman in the 8th.CaLiKrAzY - August 4, 2007
This needs to be stressed repeatedly
101halo said it just a little above here, but its been my sentiment exactly forever:CASEY KOTCHMAN IS NOT A PLATOON PLAYER. HE STARTS EVERY SINGLE DAY. I DON'T CARE IF THE PITCHER THROWS WITH HIS LEFT FOOT. KOTCHMAN IS BATTING.
The guy is .299 against righties, .304 against lefties. There isn't a reason in the world to bench him against lefties. Robb Quinlan is not good enough to take at-bats from Casey, and Casey is not low enough on the totem pole to have at-bats taken from him.
PLAY.
THE.
MAN.
Caseys Kiss of Death - August 4, 2007
lest we forget
it's this "rigidity" that got us to THIS point.Yes, I think Mike needs to move a little faster in replacing Wildman Lackey & Evil Shields. But it IS his managing that got us to our current 1st place.
It's up to the guys to maintain their standard of play. HIT the ball, CATCH the ball etc etc. You can lead the horse, yada yada yada.
Yes, I think Mike's made bad decisions for PH and defensive positions. Hindsight's 20/20
ladybug - August 4, 2007
I generally want to agree
but:Caseys Kiss of Death - August 4, 2007
but you don't know
that they are mistakes until after whatever's been done.It always starts off sounding like a good idea...then it goes down the crapper
ladybug - August 4, 2007
the thing is...
Both of these two HAVE NOT sounded like a good idea at first to many of us.We KNOW kotch can hit lefties, its just rare that Q playing instead costs us a game.
When Scoty is off his game, many of us KNOW he's not going to recover and its time to get somebody else in.
Its not the "in hindsight" calls that I'm challenging.
101halo - August 4, 2007
WTF?
If you are constantly warming up additional pitcher every time Shields comes in you're going to ruin the bullpen, so that's not a viable option.Next option please.
Seik1177 - August 4, 2007
well, it's true that you can't instantly pull him
However, Scoscia still gives him too long of a leash. I definitely respect Scot a lot and 90% of the time he is amazing. But when he's bad, if possible, he shouldn't be allowed to give up 3-4 runs.101halo - August 4, 2007
Again
This is almost impossible. It generally takes a reliever 7-15 minutes to get loose. The only way your going to stop the damage is to have someone else warming up. If we even consider that we might as well trade our bullpen for Maddon's boys. At least then we'll have a reason to really complain about the pen.There were people yelling for oliver to be DFA'd less than a month ago and now people are "accepting" him coming into the game. This great game is very cyclical.
Shields will straighten out, he's a good pitcher with a lot of experience and I don't believe he has a case of Ervintitis.
Seik1177 - August 4, 2007
I understand your point
And let me be very clear: I wouldn't trade Scot Shields for very many set up guys in baseball. He's a stud.Its simply those couple of games now and then he's off. Scoscia doesn't even start warming somebody up until its too late. Usually
101halo - August 4, 2007
weird... it cut off.
Usually about 5 min too late, which as you point out, is a crucial amount of time considering how long it takes somebody to get warmed up. This is the only challenge I'm trying to make about scoscia's use of Scot, and apologies if that wasn't clear.101halo - August 4, 2007
I understand
And I guess it's the side effect of winning that WE as fans start to nit-pick anything that doesn't work out.I like many other people here get upset when I think I could run the team better, then I realize that there is a reason I'm posting my opinion on the net and not telling them to Arte.
Seik1177 - August 4, 2007
agreed
And I usually wouldn't complain quite that much, but this whole thread was asking for us to speak to the ways in which scoscia over/under manages.101halo - August 4, 2007
I don't think
Shields is even CLOSE to having Ervinitis; more like Frankieitis. A hot-hot and a cold-cold phase.What is scaring me is I think WTY is starting a spiral towards Ervinitis. Not a rapid one, but a slow one that hopefully he'll pull himself out of before he gets sucked completely in
ladybug - August 4, 2007
and there's also been instances
when Shields has come in relatively early (6th or 7th) and Evil Shields rears his ugly head then Good Scot comes in and kicks butt.It's all a crap shoot-you're dealing with humans, not bots
ladybug - August 4, 2007
This is exactly my point,
They are human. And Scoscia needs to acknowledge that Scot's human, and when he's having an off day, he's not going to pitch well. That doesn't make him bad at his job, it just means it's time to get someone else in there, ASAP.101halo - August 4, 2007
Scioscia's "rigidity"
has also cost us Sele, Hillenbrand, Appier, Guillen, Jeff Weaver, Erstad, Kennedy, Alfonso, Carrasco, Ervin to AAA and Finley, either before their contracts were up or were able to be signed by another team.Scioscia's rigidity also brought us an average of 87 wins each season and some hardware.
Dave Garcia'a rigidity anyone? Gene Mauch's? Marcel Lachemann's?
rbrianc - August 4, 2007
Nothing is guaranteed to work 100% of the time
Did batting A-Rod 8th help the Yankees win the 2005 divisional series?There are two approaches I think. One is more short-term focussed and the other is more long-term focussed.
If you bat your slumping #2 hitting in the #9 spot, then you're putting him in a situation where you're telling him and the rest of the world that he's not valued as much. If you continue to keep him at #2, then you're saying that you think he will come out of the slump at anytime, hopefully immediately.
90% of the game is half mental.
I've noticed that Phil Jackson does the same type of thing when he doesn't call a timeout when most other teams would. Calling a timeout I think can give the opposing team momentum whereas not calling a timeout makes the opposing team somewhat confused. They're waiting for Phil to call a timeout because they're on a roll but he doesn't. He's sending a message to HIS team that he doesn't need to do anything, you guys can't resolve the issue ON YOUR OWN.
The other part of the theory I think, as it pertains to pitching, is that for the main guys, they can prepare themselves because they know they'll have a shot. If Shields goes down, he can mentally prepare himself for the next shot without worrying about whether he'll get it.
If I screw up at work, the first thing I want to do is fix it. The last thing I want to happen is not to be given a chance to fix it. And if my boss says to me don't worry about screwing up, I KNOW you'll make it right, that gives me incredible enthusiasm to do just that.
melvintoast - August 5, 2007
Being in first place ....
must be boring, because we're nitpicking when to take out a reliever who is "sturggling" by throwing 3 bad pitches.I grit my teeth and yell just as much as the next guy when Mr. Scot is pitching with his "Shields Down" - and yes, those 5??? blown holds stay with me - just like Frankie's 3 blown saves. Does that mean the Angels need a new set-up guy and closer? No. It just means that no one is perfect and the Halos wasted yet another strong pitching performance by a starter.
Now when itcomes to Soch and his stubborn streak - yeah, I second-guess a lot. But his players love him and they've won a whole lot more in the past 8-9 years than before that. This is my way of saying that we have to take the good with the bad and find some REAL issue facing the team - i.e. What's up with the rodents at the park?
Grichfan - August 6, 2007
You must Login with your SB Nation account and be a member of Halos Heaven to post a comment.